The legendary activist chats with the teacher who is trying to become the first openly trans Deputy General Secretary of the NEU
BY SUE SANDERS AND KACEY DE GROOT, IMAGES PROVIDED (LEFT), BY JESS HURD (RIGHT)
Kacey De Groot (she/her) is a teacher, trade unionist and LGBTQIA+ role model. She is a trans woman, a parent and identifies as a lesbian. She has dedicated her career to education and fighting for social justice, particularly LGBTQIA+ rights. She was awarded the Queer Student Awards Role Model (Education) of 2025. Since 2020, Kacey has sat on the Executive of the National Education Union (NEU) as the elected representative for LGBTQIA+ educators. Stepping down from that role, Kacey has now decided to stand for the elected Deputy General Secretary of the NEU, Europe’s largest education union. If elected, Kacey would become the first openly trans woman in this position.
In this exclusive interview for DIVA magazine, legendary activist Sue Sanders interviews Kacey.
Kacey, as you know, Schools OUT started as the gay teachers group back in 1974 because the unions were not doing anything for LGBTQIA+ people. Now we have 21,000 registered LGBTQIA+ educators in the National Education Union. If you could have told Paul Patrick and me this in the eighties, we would not have believed you. So how did we get here, and what was your role in it?
I’d tell you what my predecessor as LGBTQIA+ seat holder, Annette Pryce, said to me a few years ago. Moving a trade union (or a society!) is like moving an oil tanker. It’s a slow process, and it takes a lot of people. I’d tell you that, as you were standing on the shoulders of giants, you will become those giants for the next generation. And those things will change. And that change will have come from your visibility and voice.
What is it like being a trans, lesbian educator right now?
It’s difficult at the moment to be a trans lesbian educator. But at the same time, there are a lot of positive things that are taking place within our community. The culture wars against trans women have been so toxic, framing that being a trans lesbian is impossible. However, within the lesbian community itself, there is so much acceptance. In SheBar, Lick, Butch Please or the growing number of sapphic spaces, trans lesbians are lesbians and I’m here for, and celebrate that!
Educators should be a mirror of our society and our students. So often that isn’t the case, though! The pressures I’ve faced recently in school because I am trans have intensified quite brutally over the past four to five years. It includes harassment from the school’s wider community, including parents and more overt transphobia from students. It’s been difficult, but as you and Paul did in the 80s, I persevere!
What are the biggest issues facing education right now, and how will you, if elected to this role, change them?
Actually, the whole education system in England is pretty much a perfect storm right now. We can’t recruit enough people to the profession. We can’t retain them. At the heart of that is the toxic interconnected triangle of pay, workload and school funding. In real terms, since 2010, teacher pay has dropped catastrophically. But that wasn’t why teachers took strike action two years ago. It was also about the funding for schools. We can’t provide the educational experiences we want for our students, particularly those with SEND, and we are losing (or underpaying) our invaluable support staff. When we add the increased pressures of OFSTED inspections, more high-pressure testing for exams and a devastatingly narrowed curriculum that marginalises arts and creativity, we can see that it is no small problem.
The elected role will put me, as an arts practitioner and trans lesbian, in a leadership role where I will help lead the staff of the union, and outwardly speak for our members to government, the media, and government departments like the DFE or EHRC. It will feel like a huge step forward in terms of representation.
Why do you think it is important for LGBTQIA+ people and queer women to join a trade union?
I think everybody who is employed should be in a trade union! For LGBTQIA+ people specifically, it’s a way to reclaim some of our power and space. My queer comrade in the union, David Braniff-Herbert, describes the media attacks as “an air war” which we cannot win. But, on the ground, at the grassroots, we CAN win. Through a trade union, LGBTQIA+ people have the capacity to shape and influence their workplace to build the social justice that is so lacking. Collective voices and collective action, time and time again, are the only way that employers properly hear and respond to their workers! The best unions also offer and provide connection and community – this is what I’ve found in the NEU.
So tell me, how can people support your work and campaign?
Well, Sue, as you know, the election is only for NEU members, whether teachers, support staff, or education workers. If readers are members, then they just vote for me and return their ballot!
If readers aren’t NEU members but think it’s important that Europe’s largest education union does have some LGBTQIA+ and trans representation in its leadership, then they can talk to their teacher friends or colleagues and ask them to vote for me! My election statement will be on the ballot paper, but I also have a website, kaceydegroot.org, that they could point them towards!
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